hypoglycemia time-frame

[ann]

I was wondering about the hypoglycemia that results from ingesting fructose.

Is it dose-dependent (that is, the more fructose eaten, the worse the hypoglycemia)?

And, how soon (or late) does it tend to happen?

I've had frequent hypoglycemia reactions in the past, but haven't really noted a pattern of time of onset. It hasn't happened immediately after fructose, usually delayed by a few hours, and I wondered how this compares with people with known HFI.

Thanks,
Ann

[ukbill]

With me always starts within 20 min after ingestion.. although sugar in a heavy oil will delay the onset some, and also mask the flavour so its possible to eat far too much Fructose without noticing if the meal is very oily.

Yes it is dose dependent.

Sometimes you can "balance" out the small amounts of Fructose with white boiled rice for example if the dose is lowish however this can be very misleading because damage is still being done by the ingested Fructose..

This is why people can eat contaminated Glucose and not feel an immediate effect they sometimes only really feel it days later.. when they do they feel like S*** So take more Glucose to make them feel better!

If I eat a meal with Potatoes in it for example I will never feel the "benefit" of the meal as much as if I have eaten the same meal with pasta or white boiled rice instead of the potatoes.

I just do not get so much of the wonderful "glow" that normally follows a good meal. If the meal included some vegetables (or the cook put the veg water in the gravy) then I can still be as "hungry" after the meal as before I started.. even though I am physically full.

Luckily the Fructose hypo effect usually burns off long before all the meal is digested so I still get a benefit only its several hours later, and of course feel bad the next few days.

Before I started to follow a proper diet I was effectively ill all of my life.

The improvement since I have cut out all nearly the "tolerated" foods that contain Fructose is incredible!

My health and feeling of well being is just great. It's amazing how I managed for 50+ years not realising I was feeling so ill all the time.. because I had always felt like this all my life it was "Normal" to me.

I now feel better, fitter and healthier and have more energy than I have ever had!

It is strange to be 57 and feel healthier, happier and have more energy than when I was in my 20's!

[nicoleh]

Hey Bill,
if you use old potatoes and soak them, changing the water several times, and then parboil, drain and roast - do you have any issues at all then?

thinking of doing this for DD. I really have to get another carb source into her.

[ukbill]

Not as much no.

That is certainly the only way to safely prepare potatoes for an HFI person.

Its very difficult to detect the effect of very low dosages of Fructose even if I cannot taste it.

I will have to get a very sensitive blood sugar monitor and try to test myself (when I get time ) 12 hour fast followed by a known weight of potatoes and then the next day plain boiled white rice and check blood sugar for 2+ hours after.

Although I suppose it depends on the speed of breakdown of Potato starch vers eating white boiled rice?

So results might not be statistically accurate.

So far as I can tell eating instant mash potatoes is OK and also things like potato crockett's type of thing.. but then the oil in the coating might be masking some of the fructose.

Of course it depends on the sensitivity of the person.. for a double zero person ( 15 to 20% of known HFI are double zero) then no amount of potato would be safe.

Those of us with "classic" HFI still produce a tiny amount of Adolaise B in our kidneys.. however some of us (the previously mentioned 15 to 20%) produce none whatsoever.. for these people life is much more difficult, if not short

[ann]

Thanks to you both for your experience. I'm having more hypoglycemic symptoms these last two days since my fructose breath test, and my sugars have been higher after eating, too, than they usually are from low fructose foods. So my hypoglycemia seems more delayed than yours, which means also I'm probably not a true HFI.

Ann

[ukbill]

Ann there are many more versions of HFI than currently identified, your symptoms are very similar to many others on the board here.

As for us with classic HFI you will do best on a Fructose free or very low fructose diet anyway.

Many people do.

According to official figures up to 35% of the worlds population have some sort of problems with Fructose and those are just people with FM type symptoms!

So for more than 1/3rd the worlds population Fructose / sucrose is really not helping them in any way at all!

Eventually there will be some group class legal actions going and we will finally get the food industry to wake up and stop putting sugar in all foods.

Even in the UK the sugar refining industry has now a group of medical researchers trying to produce massive amounts of false or misleading data about how good sugar is supposed to be for us.

They are putting millions of £ into it so they must know how dangerous the stuff is and are trying to protect their money stream and keep people addicted.

So there is many more times the amount of money available now to researchers looking for positive benefits (and ignoring the negative effects) than available for proper research.

Yes just like the tobacco industry!

[ann]

Yeah, I agree it's criminal how much fructose is added to any food on the market. Can't trust the chicken here, as I found out from reading the fine print on packages of raw meat...."flavor enhancers" injected straight into the meat!!!

And it's in my synthroid, as a filler!!!

And as I've started to look at more vitamins, out of curiousity, there are a lot of suspicious ingredients that I don't even know what are, exactly.

Anyway, I have been very careful to follow very low fructose since my breath test.

Bill, when you refer to a double zero HFI person, does this mean homozygous for a mutation? Not sure of the terminology. Also, if that does mean homozygous, does that also mean that a person that's heterozygous will still be symptomatic, but be able to tolerate more fructose than the homozygous person, but still a lot less than someone without the mutation?

Ann

[nicoleh]

homozygous for a certain mutation or heterozygous (2 different mutations) doesn't seem to make a huge difference in the literature. much bigger difference in someone with one normal gene vs 2 abnormal genes though. Carriers with one normal gene are indeed known to have less fructose-processing ability than people with both genes normal however - as evidenced by the fact that they produce more uric acid and are therefore more prone to gout. I would also think that they are therefore probably more prone to hypoglycaemia etc - but this would only manifest if fructose intake was very high.

[ukbill]

Nicholeh knows much more about this than I will ever know.

A "Double Zero" is a person who produces NO Adolaise B at all from Liver or Kidneys.

IT is a term used here on the forum I do not think it has any official medical name. and also I am not sure about the mutation or otherwise in the genetic code for this.

With regards to expressing only one Gene and not 2 I can point to two possibles here.

My Grandfather was very poor at converting body fat back into blood sugar and would go Hypo if he did excess exercise with no food being digested.

My mother (his daughter) had gout and also is not "happy" with sugar and too much fruit and she is almost certainly FM.

My daughter when young could not convert Glycogen or body fat back into blood sugar (this changed when she reached about 18 months) and used to go into a coma and stop breathing if she had insufficient in her digestive system to keep her blood sugar level high enough.

She still has problems with her weight now. she becomes very hungry if she dose any heavy activity long before she starts to burn body fat.

There may be more info on Double zero people deep in the postings on this forum.. I think Fred posted some but then removed them later..

[nicoleh]

I am doing some VERY interesting research on aldolase B activity and what effects it. certainly more than genetics. I"ll post more when I have it, but safe to say that having certain HFI mutations does not dictate the level of aldolase B activity you have - well, not on it's own. there are at least 2 nutrients that can dramatically increase the activity of your aldolase B. I think I also now have one idea why most people report their tolerance of fructose goes down as they age. Bill, I believe you are the one person I"ve seen on this forum who has said the opposite - that you feel your liver can handle more now than when you were young, yes? if so, I have an exciting explanation!

[ukbill]

Well not certain I can handle more Fructose than when I was younger no, just that I get far less Hypo events from activity or from not eating often enough anymore.

That is because as we all age the base level for our Blood glucose slowly rises.

Hence older people get diabetes more than younger people, or did before so much Fructose was put into kids drinks anyway.

I have no idea how much it increases by but when I was 23 and had my "challenge test" of which I have written much on my 12 hour starvation level was 5 (USA 50) and I felt really light headed and not good at all.

Now I can go 20 hours or more and not really "feel" it at all!

Yes I will be hungry but that I just ignore as usual and it go's away after 20 min and will not come back for several hours. But I get no light headedness or feeling shaky and generally ill anymore from low food intake.

Although I am not doing much in the way of heavy physical activity at the moment.. I will keep you posted how I cope when I start to build a house next year!

I bet that will kick in a Hypo quickly enough if I have not eaten enough the day before!